ApexUltra is a steel that we are working on that had excellent properties in small batch production (50 lbs). Vancron would work well in a kitchen knife. So setting edge geometry for the type of knife and intended use is very important. A lot of custom makers also like S110V, including the great RJ Martin. On the flip side D2 steel is much harder than other steels in this category such as 154CM or ATS-34 and as a result holds its edge a little better. Sandvik 14C28N steel is better than D2 steel in corrosion resistance and toughness. Thank you. What is pulling that line high and to the right? But to learn more about these and other attributes, read our related outdoor knife buyers guide. And we list budget-friendly knives that have a professional style and grace to them. Rather than upgrade from D2 to M4 or S30V just drop the angle from 40 degrees to 30 degrees. ), intended use will give you all the answers. just recently the idea occured tome to sharpen a planer blade like a knife and check out how it performs. However, this edge retention comes at the cost of sharpening ease for D2. The table shows combinations of knife steel properties for different classes of steel. 14C28N knives will handle challenging and demanding applications without chipping, cracking, or breaking. But I think it would have much higher toughness than any of the steels on the chart. can you strike twice as fast with the knife? G10 I would suggest adding a second axis to the ratings charts that show the data values that the 0-10 ratings are based on (unnotched charpy impact energy, 1% saltwater , Total cards cut, etc.). I cant seem to match steel to the SS data points on the toughness/tcc graph. Looks like there is no reason to us it over 420HC. But among the steels youll find at Cabelas and the like, this is a pretty good choice. 8cr13mov if proper slicing geometry its good budget steel if you dont rust it and no prying or screwing its ok cutting steel. 1.4116 You said wood is not a particularly abrasive material and in absolute terms that is very true. It was your original article on ratings that brought me to knifesteel nerds so its great to see your results put back into a form that will no doubt be distributed \ plagiarized widely, hopefully leading to more rational thought and better understanding by the knife consuming public (not that the misleading marketing will go away). 440B It is a Sandvik stainless steel that originally developed for razor blades. Though the volume of carbonitrides in the steel is relatively high. Read more. So what is the best steel for knives? D2 steel is high carbon steel with no extra addition of Cr or Mo, that's why it is prone to corrosion. (Some crazy folks clean their Swiss Army knivesin adishwasher. I would also suggest adding a hardness rating to the ratings tables that currently include toughness, edge retention, and corrosion resistance ratings. It will take you more time and energy to get a sharp edge, but your efforts will pay off because the blades hold the edge longer. We should be suspicious of anyone who is claiming very high edge retention with a steel at low hardness and a small amount of carbide. Read more. 14C28N knives offer better toughness than D2 knives. Used in knives since at least World War II, 1095 performance varies considerably with an abundance of tweaks in the recipe and heat treat. The Sandvik 14c28n steel is ideal for the manufacturing of steel knife blades. The high hardness makes it all but impossible to sharpen and machine. YMMV The most traditional models of pocket knives have different parts, such as the handle and cutting performance. Maxamet is one of two current high-hardness kings, with HRc marks in the high 60s approaching 70, a hardness usually only seen in carbide steels. You need a hard medium to sharpen it like diamond or boride. The majority of knives target 63 Rc or below so this limitation of stainless steels does not always come into play but can be an important factor for certain knives targeting high performance and thin edges. Monday-Friday Spyderco and Cold Steel have used it, though Cold Steel recently switched to S35VN due to availability concerns. The ESEE had significant edge damage while the MagnaCut knife did not. D2. Maxamets hardness results in incredible edge retention and a nightmarish sharpening and machining experience. 14C28N steel is not very hard steel which makes it easier to sharpen. Like 154CM, its a good compromise between all three steel attributes. Ease of sharpening refers to how difficult it is to remove material with a sharpening stone. A2 knives need care taken to avoid rust and are often coated to inhibit corrosion. Here its 8. If you want to learn more about a specific steel, you can click it in the sorted listings below. Micarta Hes already done a three part series on cryogenic treatment: I will be focusing on CATRA edge retention which measures abrasive wear of knives. Spyderco has produced several production knives with Maxamet, and the steel debuted on the ZT0888. Vanax and LC200N are unique in reaching 59-60 Rc while being very stain resistant. With recommended hardness range of 55-62 HRC; the 14C28N is great for knife applications which place very high demands on edge sharpness, edge stability and corrosion resistance such as chefs knives, hunting knife, pocket knives and fishing knives. Could you please compare it to Shirogami #1 and Agomi #1, I didnt find anything in terms of grain size ragarding thoese steels on the Internert. 14C28N is the highest-selling steel of Sandvik, a Swedish steel company. It is most useful for steels with large amounts of carbide but also helps to be able to add certain carbide types. There are also hardness/toughness and hardness/TCC charts.but no tables backing this charts. Despite its wonderful performance, XHP is actually not terribly expensive compared to other high-end, all-around performers. 2. High Alloy Tool Steel and High Speed Steel Ratings. CPM154 is a truly superior steel. Privacy Policy. Thats a tiny difference, but in combination with the 420HC disparity, it conceals a full point difference between 420HC and 440A: 7.6 vs. 8.6. edge retention can vary by several orders of magnitude depending on what happens to the burr. Is that regression line (or other trend line?) XHP is an exceptionally well-balanced steel with excellent all-around attributes. This is basically a retrofit of a very old steel, adding more carbon to the recipe of 420 (hence the HC for high carbon). Is Vancron SuperClean a good choice for a chef knife? CPM 10V Steel high in carbides cant be stamped out; it must be cut by a waterjet or laser, which takes time and is more expensive. It boasts an incredible ability to continue cutting long after it seems dull. And its not made of steel. If you look at the chart you may notice that at high toughness levels if you increase edge retention by only a relatively small amount you get very big drops in toughness. Thanks! But if you want to know what the coolest blade material is, for my money, SM100is it. As to a difference between 8.6 and 8.5, all of the ratings here are rounded to the nearest 0.5 because better than that probably shows false precision. The heat treatment techniques used by the manufacturer as well as the design of the blade itself play a huge role in the ultimate outcome of knife performance! Do honing steels as used on kitchen knives actually do anything useful? Its possible that there are steel manufacturers with better processing which would lead to an even carbide distribution but I cant say that without seeing it for myself. Why does Maxamet and Rex 121 stay the same tcc but Zmax drops and 15v goes from below 900 to over? Some of our partners may process your data as a part of their legitimate business interest without asking for consent. Is there a reason SG2/R2 are not included in the lineup, despite being one of the most popular ones? Heat treatment refers to the heating and cooling steps employed to achieve your knifes proper balance of attributes. Typically an increase in corrosion resistance means a reduction in potential hardness for a given steel. CPM-3V is a powder metallurgy contender in this category. D2 steel also offers similar toughness levels as the 14c28n steel, so both aren't really prone to chipping with proper use. 420HC, 420, and 5160 all offer off-the-charts toughness. Thanks. They were two different tests (different batch of steel, different person heat treating, etc). Moreover, the blades will serve you longer because they do not wear out faster with frequent use and sharpening. Five years ago, S30V had a premium price. These images are taken from my book Knife Engineering. 14C28N knives are easier to sharpen than D2 knives. Very acute edges are more brittle but remain sharp for longer and cut very well. Ive not seen these used on non-kitchen knives, though, and it seems that if they had real utility they would be used in other knives as well although perhaps on the thinner edges of kitchen knives they are more effective than they would be elsewhere? Damascus or pattern welded steel is a result of combining two steels together. This showed that XHP and ZDP-189 have significantly lower corrosion resistance than other stainless steels. There are so many interactions between them that predictions are difficult without modeling software. By rejecting non-essential cookies, Reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform. Flashlights run the gamut of price and quality. Lets talk about the clip-on pocket knife. Hi Larrin Your estimate of 420HCs corrosion resistance is different here than in your October, 2019 post on corrosion resistance testing: https://knifesteelnerds.com/2019/10/14/corrosion-resistance-testing/ 1. Recommendations are welcome, If you are cutting against metal I would maybe try K390 in a Spyderco or an S110V knife if you need stainless. I just want to thank you for all the work you do for the community and the world at large. These are Chinese-produced steels that recently started showing up in Chinese-made knives. its like with cars, most of them are not a corvette or a porsche. 1. This makes for a great slicing knife and a perfect steel, in my opinion, for a regular-use, everyday-carry folder. . 14C28N vs D2: Overview 14C28N steel is a high-end stainless steel created by the Swedish company Sandvik. However, it can be somewhat complicated because an edge can dull from many causes wear, micro-chipping, deformation, or corrosion. Marco, BSc Chem. 14C28N and D2 steel are not the same. But in my experience, it has been nothing but great. Carpenter produces this powder steel. False treatment and geometry upheld by Made in USA is like buying 8Cr from China (except late A.G) My personal experience tops with Vanadis 4E, CPM-M4, RWL-34 and the likes. Im writing a book about choosing a knife for EDC. With a high level ofedge retention, corrosion resistance, and toughness, it does most everything quite well. Below shows a comparison of carbide structure between D2 and CPM-D2, and then toughness measurements between the conventional and PM versions of CruWear, D2, and 154CM. 8670 and 5160 are good choices for large knives that need very high toughness. Its in the same class as Vanadis 8 and 10V. However, I would argue that pure material removal is usually not the limiting step for ease in sharpening. D2 steel, on the other hand, is tool steel, and its knives shine on edge retention and wear resistance. Honestly, yes, because its perfect steel for your knife, besides it depends on which knife, so when youre talking about chef knives, then 14c28n would be an ideal pick thanks to professional corrosion resistance and edge retention. We and our partners use data for Personalised ads and content, ad and content measurement, audience insights and product development. There are a few other complicating factors such as carbon in solution and plate martensite, especially in low alloy steels such as described in this article. Powder metallurgy steels with low vanadium content like CPM-1V and Z-Tuff/CD#1 have extremely high toughness. 1. And below shows a chart of carbide hardness, the equation we created to predict edge retention based on edge angle, hardness, and carbide volumes, and then the chart showing the good correlation: TCC (mm) = -157 + 15.8*Hardness (Rc) 17.8*EdgeAngle() + 11.2*CrC(%) + 14.6*CrVC(%) + 26.2*MC(%) + 9.5*M6C(%) + 20.9*MN(%) + 19.4*CrN(%). A Japanese powder steel, ZDP-189 is essentially the polar opposite of 3V its uber-hard instead of uber-tough. Vanadium carbides are among the hardest that form in steel, and chromium carbides are in between iron carbide and vanadium carbide. Still looking forward to magnacut making it into high volume production and use. Steel produced in China is generally less expensive. Toughness 3, Edge Ret 8, Cor Res 4? Uddeholm lists it as somewhat worse in toughness than A2 but somewhat better in wear resistance. Get for a complete guide about other steel; you can read 14c28n vs 8cr13mov reviews. You can read about my CATRA edge retention testing in this article. And Ive done a lot of experimental work on knife steels where I feel more confident in my own ratings. . Copper frame are very sturdy and machine well and take the best patina over time. 7:00am-5:00pm, 10am-7pm Tuesday - Friday I mean the box cutter type, with the replaceable trapezoidal blades. D2 knives offer higher edge retention than 14C28N knives, which is attributed to the high carbon elements and hardness of D2. But which? Coarse-carbide tool steel grades. CPM-S90V, CPM-S110V, CPM-10V, and Bohler K390 each fit in this category. I have a question about the chart High toughness steels can be produced without powder metallurgy and also have low wear resistance for lower manufacturing costs. and yet millons of knives are being made out of 1.4116 (aisi 420mov?) . It should get an ultra-sharp edge for easy cutting, hold the edge for long for easy maintenance, and have a sturdy and ergonomic handle for comfort and to prevent accidents. A new steel from Crucible, SPY27 launched in 2020 in the Spyderco Native 5and Para 3. I am particularly interested in researching knife steel, knife properties, and brands. This particular steel grade allows for the highest attainable hardness without. In its most basic form, steel is just iron and carbon, but people have been studying, experimenting with, and perfecting steel with other elements for specific applications for millennia. I have the average composition of the steels rated above (plus some extras) so you can see what the different names refer to. However, high wear resistance means that abrasives are used up more rapidly, more careful grinding is necessary to avoid overheating, finishing and polishing is much more time consuming, etc. Dr. Thomas you spoke of using a different media for cutting test and I have some extra veg tan leather and was wondering what are the parameters of the leather you need? However, the 14c28n provides perfect edge retention with a maximum hardness of 62Hrc and the mixture of Chromium and Carbon. Knifemakers use dozens of steel types to create knife blades. I wont go into detail about those here. Importing steel from Europe to the USA, or vice versa, generally increases the cost. Often used for combat knives. Become a patron and gain access to awesome rewards including early access to articles or a Knife Steel Nerds mug! If you are a newbie, sharpening D2 knives will be a struggle, but it is doable with practice and the right sharpening tools. And for high toughness you want little or no carbide. If the steel is overheated in austenitizing, very large reductions in toughness are possible. HA! The line is only in the neighborhood of 5 of the datapoints. Its exceedingly tough and relatively hard, but its not stainless. Because of the material difference, the blades differ in toughness, edge retention, corrosion resistance, and ease of sharpening. The ratings I have are for an optimal heat treatment. Between the assisted open, weird looking texture designs, and the stainless steel handle, the Cannonball has a lot of features I don't normally like, but even I have to admit it's a good design for the price. how much more can you bend/pry with it? Developed by New Jersey Steel Baron, Nitro V is a non-powder steel marketed as an enhanced version of AEB-L. Nitro V, as its name indicates, adds nitrogen to AEB-Ls formula to make the steel even more corrosion-resistant. I always thought VG10 to be way more chippy/less tough compared cpms45vn. There is one exception: Bucks 420HC (Buck and onlyBuck) is produced using a proprietary heat treatment. Steels patina in the acid at varying rates which allows for one steel to etch darker than the other and show that famous patterned contrast. D2 is a high carbon, high chromium die steel and is the highest carbon alloy tool and die steel typically used in knife making. Most production knives are more than thick enough at the edge to accommodate a regrind to significantly improve performance, and its a lot cheaper than buying a new knife a lot of the time. Ive seen more talk and some articles regarding the use of AI to come up with new potential drug molecules, polymeric materials, etc. What makes 1.4116 such a bad performer in regards to toughness on par with ultra high carbide steel like S125V? The D2, on the other hand, has a thicker and more durable blade that is better suited for tough tasks like chopping wood or prying open cans. Everyone has their own opinion on what they deem the best folding EDC knife. All Rights Reserved. This is a virtually stain-proof steel suitable for all sorts of aquatic environments. Would be great if some manufactures changed their steels based on this information. Wear resistance, be it high or low, is the most significant determining factor in ease of sharpening. Being stainless is not an on or off property, and some stainless steels are more resistant to corrosion than others. This was not necessarily because of superior toughness but because of the superior strength of the MagnaCut from higher hardness.